EPISODE 3: Rich Clark / Clark’s
Rich Clark on Branding Clark’s and Creating a Restaurant Concept That Feels Entirely Its Own
Restaurateur Rich Clark joins Jaci Lund while Treebird is in the middle of developing and executing the brand for Clark’s, his new Southern steakhouse concept. Rich talks about building a distinctive restaurant, the value of precision and consistency, and what the Treebird branding process has been like from the client side.
WHAT THIS EPISODE ANSWERS
What was the Treebird branding process like for Clark’s?
Rich calls the logo, branding and Treebird team “seamless” and says the team does what it says it will do. He also describes the process as professional and enjoyable.
How did Treebird get to the heart of Rich Clark’s vision?
Rich says Jaci’s questions got inside his head in a way previous branding experiences had not, helping the team understand what he wanted the new concept to become.
Why was it important for Clark’s to have its own identity?
Rich is clear that the new steakhouse needs to be its own concept. The conversation centers on originality, precision and creating an experience that is distinct from his other restaurants.
WHAT THEY SAY ABOUT TREEBIRD
“The logo and the branding and your team have been seamless.”
“Everybody does what they say they’re going to do. That’s super professional.”
“Working with you was so much fun because when you ask me these questions... you really got inside my head.”
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Announcer (00:08)
You're listening to Beyond the Logo. Jaci Lund, founder and creative director of Treebird Branding explores what it means to cultivate a brand that endures actionable branding advice rooted in an audience first philosophy and candid conversations with clients about the challenges they faced and the creative solutions that transformed their business. This is thoughtful strategic guidance for visionary business owners who understand that great branding isn't launched. It's cultivated. If you're ready to invest in branding that creates lasting impact, you're in the right place. Welcome to Beyond the Logo.
Jaci Lund (00:47)
Rich Clark, welcome.
Rich Clark (00:48)
Hi, JC. I'm
Jaci Lund (00:49)
So excited to talk to you today.
Rich Clark (00:51)
Great to talk to
Jaci Lund (00:52)
You. Yeah, so this is Rich Clark. He is a restaurateur. He owns C&S Seafood and soon to be open classic Southern Steakhouse Clarks. You're one of the most passionate and intentional people that I've had the pleasure of getting to know, especially when it comes to your business and even things I hear about the way you interact with your family. I just really admire you. Oh, that's nice. So I wanted to talk to you today. Another reason why I wanted to talk to you today is because we're in the middle of your project for Clark's we've done the branding so far and now we're heading into the execution and all of the craziness that goes into an opening.
Rich Clark (01:32)
Yes. So far, like I was saying, so far the logo and the branding in your team have been seamless. Thank you. Everybody does what they say they're going to do that's super professional. I always love it when I'm the most unprofessional person in the room. That's always good. It's a
Jaci Lund (01:47)
Good sign. It's a good sign
Rich Clark (01:49)
That I'm working with people that are smarter than me. But anyway, we're about halfway there. Construction so far has been the easiest I've done out of any of my projects and even the ones that I've worked in before I was an owner. We got a long way to go. The team is coming along. Like I was saying, the good thing about the team is we've worked together. We've all worked together for quite some time. So we've all seen the worst of each other and we're still around. So you can't put a price tag on that, but we feel really good about it. We're very, very excited. Excited to work with you, excited about the new concept. Very scary. I'm having nightmares nightly, but that's okay. That means, like you said, he's passionate, which is always a word for I've got a bad temper.
Jaci Lund (02:36)
I don't see it that way.
Rich Clark (02:37)
That's what my employees tell me. That's why I made that bad joke. Well,
Jaci Lund (02:41)
I always feel like I know you care, which great.
Rich Clark (02:46)
And that's
Jaci Lund (02:46)
More
Rich Clark (02:46)
Important. See how you could be really doing anything that you don't care about, in my opinion, and certainly not in this business because it's a lot of work, but it's super fun doing all this and coming up with the logo. So working with you was so much fun because when you ask me these questions about coming up with the logo, you really got inside my head and I've been through that before with other people and it was just such a fun experience. Good. I'm so
Jaci Lund (03:16)
Glad.
Rich Clark (03:16)
Anyway, happy to be here.
Jaci Lund (03:17)
Thank you. Well, I want to go back in time a little bit because I actually met you probably, don't even remember. I was actually with Torin Anderson
Rich Clark (03:24)
At
Jaci Lund (03:24)
CNS probably 12 years ago and that was the first time I got to experience CNS and I became a fan right away. And so something that my parents and my dad really likes is Precision, which is why my family and I have always been huge fans of CNS because of the precision. And I just wanted to hear your thoughts on that because you and your team are so precise. It's so consistent and so good.
Rich Clark (03:51)
Well, we tried to do that, which is why we have three. We branded CNS and I wanted to steakhouse because I'm-
Jaci Lund (03:58)
Why not?
Rich Clark (03:59)
Why not? Well, it's going to be fun and it is passionate. But anyway, back to precision. When I came out of college or I'm sorry, when I started college, I said, "Well, I want to be a banker. I want to be an accountant and I don't want to do that. I want to be marketing." And so I went to work, I got a job at the Ritz-Carlton and that was it. That was it, man. That was a wrap. The first day I worked there when I worked with Danielle today, my matrid, and I was working the luncheon buffet. I thought I had got the greatest job. They were just happy to get me,
Rich Clark (04:33)
But I didn't know it to set this buffet up every day. But I was like, "Man, this is where I want to be. " And I worked my way up to be a captain and then I went to work for Gunter Seager back in the day and I was like, "This is what I want to do. " Because I found something that I really enjoyed and liked. And hours are hours. They're going to be the hours, whatever you're going to do are hours. And I was like, "I think I can make some money doing this too." These managers are all walking around and like the GMs are walking around in Armani Sues and driving BMWs and-
Jaci Lund (05:07)
That was aspirational.
Rich Clark (05:09)
I don't think they're like that much smarter than me. They just work a lot and I'm already doing that. So anyway, that's where really kind of the consistency came from. And when we opened up, I just enjoy that type of dining. I'm really excited about Clark's because we get to really kind of take it up another level with Gary Dawn Service, which is another kind of rolling it back to my past. We use Gary Dawn service and everything and having these things handmade in England. So it's really going to be a lot of fun.
Jaci Lund (05:38)
That's great. So it sounds like a specific level of excellence is very almost in a way comforting to you. That's like your home base.
Rich Clark (05:47)
It is. That's
Jaci Lund (05:48)
Amazing.
Rich Clark (05:50)
I enjoy dealing with that.
Rich Clark (05:53)
I had another restaurant that was casual and I sold it and I really enjoyed that, but I'm more comfortable in maybe a more elevated setting for whatever reason. I'm more comfortable dealing with the guest where the expectations are super hard to meet and they're more traveled than me. That was the thing that I learned at the Ritz-Carlton and I travel a lot now and there's certainly more people that travel to me, but I was like, "Wow, these people really know a lot." And so back then you would have to read. So I'd read wine books and books on France and books on Italy so I could relate to the guests. And that's no lie. That's the truth because I just loved it. It's so much fun. And what's that fun about Foragua and red burgundy and perolos. I mean, that's fun. You know what I mean?
Jaci Lund (06:41)
Yeah.
Rich Clark (06:42)
But you better get it right because they're all expensive.
Jaci Lund (06:45)
Well, that kind of leads into my next question, which you sort of touched on too. And we had a meeting yesterday, so there's a lot of fresh things in my mind. And so talking about like the fear of not meeting those expectations or going above and beyond and with this new concept, how do you manage doubt?
Rich Clark (07:02)
You use it as fuel. You use it as fuel. And I know that sounds probably cliche, but that's a great question. I had this conversation with my daughter this morning about her basketball and her grades. I'm like, listen, you've got to look at what you haven't done where you've fallen short and you don't dwell in the past because you'll be stuck on stupid,
Rich Clark (07:25)
But you certainly look at that and say, "I'm not going to do that again." But how you fueled that, you use it as fuel. I know what I want. I'm very clear. I go over over and over and over and over again to make sure that I can explain it because if I can't explain it, I'm DOA because I had a concept once I couldn't explain and the concept is no longer. So going back to that, you use that. What's the scary part is, how do I get what I want to do down to my employees?That's what scares me because what I like to do is I like to take people with experience, but not too much experience and everyone says that, but you have to be- Yeah.
Jaci Lund (08:10)
How do you bring them in, especially when Clarks is under construction?
Rich Clark (08:14)
Well, they've worked with me. You spend a lot of money, which is the fun part, going places that are similar to what you're going to. I want to be very clear on this. Our concept is unique and it is ours. There is not one thing borrowed from anyone, you know what I mean? I don't know who invented the crab cake, but I'm not stealing the crab cake from anyone or that lollipop rib. I mean like
Jaci Lund (08:40)
A classic is a classic.
Rich Clark (08:43)
Word.You go and we look and you're very ... When we do these things and we travel and we go to places, you go to New York or Chicago or Charleston or Austin, all these places, we make sure that there's a reason that we're going there and you don't go to critique because anyone can do that. That's what losers do. You go and you say, "What are they doing well? See, this is what I want to do. How are we going to execute it? " And we go over planning systems and systems and systems and systems and systems until you can't get it wrong. My father was an airline mechanic and a damn good one and a foreman and an inspector. And so growing up, one of the funnest thing, but everything had to be spot on.
Jaci Lund (09:28)
So precise.
Rich Clark (09:28)
Precise. Yeah. If I wasn't doing this, I'd probably be an architect or something like that. Yeah.
Jaci Lund (09:33)
You
Rich Clark (09:33)
Know what I mean? You just got to go over it and over and over. And getting into the systems and how you get it right, any fluff, anything that doesn't make sense, get rid of it. Get
Jaci Lund (09:42)
Rid of it.
Rich Clark (09:43)
Get rid of it.
Jaci Lund (09:44)
How are you describing Clark's now to your team or to other people since it's
Rich Clark (09:49)
Announced? It's a classic steakhouse with Southern influence. So a classic steakhouse would be quiet, fine dining, big steaks, dark, wood, lot of millwork. And the southern influence we're doing, I'm remiss to say this, but the food is kind of an elevated, rustic food because we're grilling on live fire. I was going to be a broiler. I've always been told and I've always come up in the high temp broiler and then I went to Austin, Texas and I went to, I'm going to give a plug to Jay Carver's restaurant. I was actually at a cocktail party with Kevin Oots from Spotted Trotter.
Jaci Lund (10:33)
Oh my God.
Rich Clark (10:33)
Yeah, man. He's a man. And so we knew some people, knew some people and he worked at some place. I'm front of house guy, by the way. And so is he doing broiler or live fire? And I said, "Broiler, man, all puffed up."
Jaci Lund (10:47)
You're feeling
Rich Clark (10:47)
Really confident about it? 1800. He goes, "You going to dinner with me tonight?" I said, "Yeah, we're all going. " So we went and it's the same meat by lens, that's my purveyor and they grill that stuff on the live fire. And I looked at my corporate chef and I said, "This is it, man." I call it steak Jesus. I was like, "This is what we're doing." So then I went out and I bought a $8,000 grill for my house. Just to test it out? To test it out just to make sure that this is what I wanted to do because you get one shot at these things and it's like-
Jaci Lund (11:23)
I mean, I guess the grill has to do what the grill does. How do you ensure precision on live fire?
Rich Clark (11:30)
You just really work at it, I suppose. I'll let you know.
Jaci Lund (11:33)
I don't
Rich Clark (11:33)
Want to
Jaci Lund (11:33)
Add to your
Rich Clark (11:34)
Nightmares at night. I have two recurring nightmares. One is that all my bartenders quit and I'm behind the bar and I haven't bartended and ma, I haven't hopped behind the bar in probably 10 years. I used to be able to sling pretty good back in the day, but I have that one. The last one I had, these three ladies just sit in front of me and they all ordered three martinis with three different vodkas and then I only had one clean glass and no ice. Oh
Jaci Lund (11:59)
My God.
Rich Clark (12:00)
So that's one. And the other one is that we overcook every steak in the room. I think something is wrong with me. Well,
Jaci Lund (12:07)
Let's take it to a more positive place. What does success look like for you? In any restaurant concept, how do you feel? Not necessarily like what you're
Rich Clark (12:17)
Doing. Success, that's a dubious. I know. That's a duties term. Profitability's nice. I mean, I can sit here and talk numbers all day. You have a certain percentage on profit. Well, first of all, you want to be profitable because I've been through when we opened our first place up in 2007, it was great. And then 2008 came on and it was not good at all. We were still around, but that was hard. And then I had a concept that didn't make it and then the pandemic. So profitability at all is very good. With that said, I'm no spring chicken and I've been around long enough to where I know what I want to do from a profitability standpoint. There's a percentage that I want to make, but I don't worry about that probably for two years.
Rich Clark (13:08)
We worry about being profitable, but getting everything correct. Success is when you're proud of it. When I have something that wows me, like the chopped salad yesterday, I'll give you an example. So I had gumbo, chopped salad and a piece of salmon. And when I ate my chopped salad, which I'm very proud of, John my partner and I, I was like, "Man, this thing's good. I'll take the Pepsi challenge with anybody." And that felt like success when what we're trying to do as a brand, like when we were coming in, the gentleman before me was like, "Hey, that's always good to hear." I mean, that's really it.
Jaci Lund (13:51)
My last guest, Chris Hall in the hallway, mentioned that he received feedback about the Galleria location for CNS from someone else and he was excited to get to share that with Rich.
Rich Clark (14:02)
Yeah. So that feels good. And then watching my employees move up, that's probably what I'm most proud of watching people buy homes and 401k and that's- Yeah, you're providing a lifestyle. Reviews of reviews is always nice, but it's people we're humans, man. And so when you get to interact with that, that's kind of what I am most proud of.
Jaci Lund (14:29)
Are you ever tickled when you see someone, at least I am.That's a part of success for me is when I hear my employees say something the way I would say it to solve a problem or if you're like, "That's a richism and they've got it. They've nailed it.
Rich Clark (14:44)
" Yes. I use that today as a matter of fact, our director of operations, Alexa Robertson, she's Johnny on the spot. She's a little bit of a killer.
Rich Clark (14:57)
I was telling my team we're going to roll some new things out and sometimes it takes a little longer than needs to be because I wanted it two days ago and I'm like, "Nah, we doing a RC and AR style." Her name's Alexa Robertson. And Alexa's like, "That's right." We go, "Yeah, that's always good." But on the other hand too, like I say, I like to be wrong. We're having a cocktail dinner tonight and they did it behind my back and I was so mad and I was like ... Well, I wasn't mad. I would give myself credit at 57. I'm calming down, but I was like, "What is this rum cocktail dinner thing? Nobody's going to buy that. " They said, "Rich, we sold this thing out in 20 minutes."
Jaci Lund (15:41)
Wow.
Rich Clark (15:42)
What a great thing to be wrong about. It's only 30 people and I'm like, "Yeah, man, we make a lot of money on
Jaci Lund (15:49)
Rum." That's
Rich Clark (15:49)
Awesome. And the menu's great and everything, I'm really excited about that. So it's a fine line there, but I'm rambling.
Jaci Lund (15:59)
So how does branding relate to success to you? Or when did it click for you that branding played a piece of that puzzle? Even something like a richism to me is part of the brand, the energy of the brand. It's not just the logo and the words, but where did that click for you in your kind of restaurant tour journey?
Rich Clark (16:22)
Trial and error because you have to listen, man, especially when it's a new concept because Clark's going to be different than when Clark opens. I would bet everything that I have and borrow what I could, but that in six months after we're opening, there's going to be things that I am sure of that's on Flight 86 and things that ... And you have to listen. It's
Jaci Lund (16:44)
Like a cocktail dinner you don't think is going to sell out.
Rich Clark (16:46)
You just got to- And like I said, I don't like to be wrong about everything, but branding's always been ... When you open your second place, when I opened my second CNS, that was when I had to get very ... When I had Hugo's before I sold it, it was still seafood, seafood was two different concepts. I was like, "Man, I've got to really get consistent." And that's something that I feel I'm good at.
Jaci Lund (17:09)
But you're very good at consistency.
Rich Clark (17:10)
I'm because I think something's wrong with me. But anyway, staying on brand is something that I say a lot and how you have to stay on brand. When we first opened CNS, the menu, I have a heavy French background. My partner, John Schwank, has a heavy French background. We met at Brasserie La Cos. So the menu was very Frenchy Tudorosini with Wagua on top of it and Skate Mini and all this stuff. And before French burgundy's got to be ... You can't afford them all types of burgundies on the glass and it was really, really good. And then the recession happened and we had to kind of pivot and the brand changed and we were happy to change with it. And then we start hiring more people and they want to change what is working for us. You cannot let people get in your head.
Rich Clark (18:04)
This is my brand, man. I got no hate for anyone, but this is our brand. If you want to discuss it, we can discuss it, but do not change anything, nothing. So that's being consistent, knowing who you are and you have to be able to get it out of your mouth. If you are not clear, start over.
Jaci Lund (18:34)
Well, and that's the whole point of branding is that it makes a memory. And so if you're constantly shifting and changing and even down to where your purveyors are from, you're not creating that memory.
Rich Clark (18:47)
Vishy carrots. So we have visi carrots on. It's carrots, you poach them in soda water, toss them with butter, a little sugar into it. I swear
Jaci Lund (18:57)
Every time we meet, I get hungry, but go on.
Rich Clark (18:59)
So we're getting blasted during the recession, right? And so there's all these small plates, restaurants opening and this and that. It's not going well. I'm like, "Well, why am I going to do small plates with tuna with the piece of fur goal on top?" That's not going to work.
Rich Clark (19:15)
So this is when all the cool different sides came on. And so I was like, "John, our sides are no good." Sauteed spinach and Vishi carrots, that's tired. We need to change them. And so we're going to start with a carrot. So we put on all these cool stuff, roasted eggplant and heirloom carrots with harissa oil and yogurt. One day that lasted. I'm not kidding. I tell the story everywhere when somebody changes it. I say this, Vishy carrots. Vishy carrots. That's my brand. I got phone call, two phone calls from customers now friends of mine, Brad and Rebecca Nuts. What'd you do to carrots, man? Change them back. And we changed their back and I'm like, it's Oprah aha moment. And I'm like, okay, this is who we are. We just stay the course. Yeah. Just pick something and don't move.
Jaci Lund (20:04)
So when they're coming in, are the carrots just like on the table already waiting for
Rich Clark (20:07)
Them? They moved to Orange Beach where they come in- How
Jaci Lund (20:10)
Dare they?
Rich Clark (20:13)
It sells me rib ice, but anyway.
Jaci Lund (20:16)
So when it came to making decisions about Clark's and putting your team together, we're so thrilled to work with you on this project too, being that I have admired CNS for all these years. Yes.
Rich Clark (20:27)
Thank you. Thank
Jaci Lund (20:27)
You. So why Treebird
Rich Clark (20:29)
Part of that decision? Because Peter Zackus recommended you. Yeah. Peter Zakis is my designer and he just spoke so highly of you and then we talk concept and the fact that you did another logo for another steak restaurant.
Jaci Lund (20:43)
I've done a lot of steakhouses actually.
Rich Clark (20:45)
So we were talking and you're just so fun to talk to. And then through the process was different than any process I've ever been through. I don't want Clark's to be like CNS. I do not want to be CNS is CNS and I'm extremely proud of it. Clarks is its own thing. Clark hasn't made one cent of anything at all. We have done nothing. We have done nothing. I hope that we do, but I- You're going
Jaci Lund (21:14)
To do very well.
Rich Clark (21:15)
Well, we haven't done anything yet. We've got a long way to go. With that said, I had the same designer, but I'm involved in all the design with all of the restaurants, but this one, the gallery I was very heavily involved in.
Jaci Lund (21:30)
It's beautiful
Rich Clark (21:31)
In there. Thank you. And then Clark's, I was like, "Hey man, this thing's got to be different." So we, how do you say it? We had some inspiration for some other architectural places around. And so I was like, I don't want people going in there and say, "Oh, this looks like a CNS." I don't want that.
Announcer (21:47)
Yeah.
Rich Clark (21:48)
Now if I have another Clark's, which God willing, that's the whole plan here is steak and seafood never goes out of style. They better be the same. It's that story and I wanted something different and Peter just recommended you and we couldn't be happier. I love the logo. And I do. And I just can't wait for the website and working with you guys and social media and everything. It's very nice. So if you want to do something different, you got to do something different. You got to do something different. "Hey, I want to do something different, but I'm going to do the same thing. "That makes no sense. It's like talking to my daughter.
Jaci Lund (22:22)
I appreciate the Zach's fellows so much too. We've worked with them on probably six different jobs. I love their interiors and I don't know. Something about working on this brand with you, it's been a very common soothing process.
Rich Clark (22:33)
With me?
Jaci Lund (22:33)
Yes. It's been so relaxed and just, I don't know. It feels relaxed because you are on top of your shit and-
Rich Clark (22:42)
Wait till we open, come in there and get a load of it.
Jaci Lund (22:44)
Oh, I told you I'll be there
Rich Clark (22:46)
On site. First person use a marking train. Well, I can't because I get in too much trouble now, man, because I want to wind up. No,
Jaci Lund (22:52)
It's just been a very like ... Well, you were very intentional and you started early enough too. So it gives us time to create excellence and also to get creative and to give this ... I just love the idea of it being this classic with the southern twist and I like the word that you use rustic and like how can we give this almost ... I want it to have wood. It's like wood and leather.
Rich Clark (23:16)
It's what it is, man.
Jaci Lund (23:18)
Yeah.
Rich Clark (23:18)
It's leather. We got El Contera, which is a high premium suede. We have a real wood floor. It's so
Jaci Lund (23:25)
Tactile.
Rich Clark (23:26)
You just want to touch everything. Everything. And I'm like that. That's why I have Mohare on my ... I just sit there. The Mohair situation, I was in Miami That place is crazy. And I was at the Surf Club, which is Thomas Keller's place. So I think it's the Four Seasons place. It's just big pimping and it's a continental place. And so we walk in there and everything's pink and white. It's very Miami and it's in Mid Beach, I think. Bar Harbor. Anywhere. Anyway, it's the Four Seasons and I'm like, man, what is this? And I just kept rubbing the chair like, What is this chair? Anyway, I'm paying $40 for a crab cake and $30 for a Caesar salad. This is back then too. Well, then you
Jaci Lund (24:12)
Better like to touch the chair.
Rich Clark (24:14)
It's Miami too. There is no budget in Miami. So anywho, I was like, Peter, man. So like a week later we flew down there and he goes, That's mohair. So we use mohair, we use leather. Textures are very important to me, much to the chagrin of my accountant. He has given up on me. I'm like, I don't want to do ... No
Jaci Lund (24:35)
One saved their way to greatness is something my dad literally just said.
Rich Clark (24:38)
He should have never told
Jaci Lund (24:39)
Me that. I know. I'm sorry. He said it this weekend and we were in the pool. He said, no one ever saved their way to greatness. We were talking about the bean counters and how creative folks like us need them, but how sometimes we just have to go over their head because we have a vision. I think I was talking about Disney World and when the bean counters were kind of ruining the brand. They did. There was not enough vision in place and then Iger came along. Anyways, that's where that came from. But yeah, you can't say the
Rich Clark (25:02)
Whole thing. Coca-Cola has a story like that too because CFOs kind of mess up. But with all said, I would not be here without my accountant. Oh
Jaci Lund (25:10)
Yeah, we
Rich Clark (25:11)
Need that. Anyway, but yeah, the finishes in there are high end. It means a lot to me.
Jaci Lund (25:17)
And how do you want people to feel like it's such a sensory experience with the texture- Want to feel like they're sitting on leather. With the brand, with the sound, how do you want them to feel?
Rich Clark (25:26)
I want them to feel like they're on vacation. I
Jaci Lund (25:28)
Want
Rich Clark (25:29)
Them to feel like they're somewhere else. I want them to feel like they're ... It's in my mission statement that we want you to feel like you're on vacation. When you
Jaci Lund (25:36)
Go into a casino and you walk out, it's still daylight and
Rich Clark (25:38)
You're like,
Jaci Lund (25:39)
"I have transported."
Rich Clark (25:40)
I want to be memorable and like you're dining out on vacation because people have choices everywhere and it's true, but you have to believe this because if you don't believe this, because I believe it, I have choices. I spend an ungodly amount of money traveling and everything and I do research when I go out
Rich Clark (26:01)
And there's this level of expectations that if I'm not ... And we don't meet them all the time and it makes me angry and sad and it makes me feel inadequate, but we try and when we mess up, we want to have an opportunity to and we try to be ... We always put the guests first. I mean, that's a given, man. When you come in, we want you to feel like you're in a high end place. So you can't be in a high end place and charge, in my opinion, maybe other people do. And if they can, God bless them, but we've got $100 steaks on there. $100 steak's a lot of money, man. Especially since the pandemic, price of stakes were crazy used to be $32. It's 55 everywhere you go. I know what I pay, but anyway, you can't charge that and go, in my opinion, and go buy your chairs from Restaurant Depot.
Rich Clark (26:56)
You have metal
Jaci Lund (26:57)
Chairs.
Rich Clark (26:57)
You're from Restaurant Depot or some BS fixtures or open ceiling. I mean, maybe you can. I can't. And at the end of the day, I like my places to be somewhere where I would like to.
Jaci Lund (27:11)
You want to go?
Rich Clark (27:11)
Yeah, man, because that's where I want to go. And if people are digging it, that's great. You know what I mean? If they don't, then I messed up.
Jaci Lund (27:21)
I feel like that's why I felt so aligned and was so excited to work with you on this and the team was too because we have such an audience first mentality. I want you to like your brand, but it has your name on it.
Rich Clark (27:33)
Right.
Jaci Lund (27:33)
But if it doesn't resonate-
Rich Clark (27:35)
There's your humility over here.
Jaci Lund (27:37)
I did push you. It was on the table and I said, "You're naming it Clarks." To
Rich Clark (27:42)
Be
Jaci Lund (27:42)
Fair, we did shove you a little. It sounds sharp, I think. But it's a really good name. I'm sorry. If
Rich Clark (27:48)
Your name was
Jaci Lund (27:49)
Not that good, maybe
Rich Clark (27:50)
We'd like you. And I work really, really ... I mean, everyone works hard on everything, but I've worked ... This has been years in the
Jaci Lund (27:58)
Making.
Rich Clark (27:59)
This
Jaci Lund (28:00)
Is your legacy
Rich Clark (28:00)
Project. I'm out of my comfort zone. I was being chicken. But
Jaci Lund (28:05)
It's
Rich Clark (28:05)
Good to
Jaci Lund (28:05)
Push yourself, I
Rich Clark (28:06)
Think. We'll find out. We're finding out right now. But it's been super fun, a lot of anxiety, but you just have to stay nice and clear. I've been a lot of exercise, not drinking the wine at night because that doesn't help as much, maybe a coule. Well,
Jaci Lund (28:21)
It's funny. Something flashed before. I'm going to call back to it and you're talking about doubt and letting that drive you. And I know your daughter is super into basketball. I'm curious, did you watch the 30 for 30 thing with Michael Jordan?
Rich Clark (28:34)
I watched that a hundred million times. I make my daughter watch that.
Jaci Lund (28:37)
When he said ... Yes. I was going to say, have your daughter watch it. And you're just reminding me of that moment that actually came up so many times and I loved it so much watching Michael Jordan because I felt like, yes, he gets me because spite is what drove me to do Treebird. And that drives me
Rich Clark (28:51)
My
Jaci Lund (28:51)
Success.
Rich Clark (28:52)
No, I understand.
Jaci Lund (28:53)
And when he would say like ... And I took offense to that and then would go and win. And he was finding these things however small, even he made some up in his head to drive him. I'm curious if this is your natural instinct to drive you forward to excellence. Well,
Rich Clark (29:11)
It's funny. All right, I'm going to talk about myself a little.
Jaci Lund (29:14)
Yeah.
Rich Clark (29:15)
So yesterday, my daughter's a very good basketball player, a good student. I don't have a good daughter. I have a great daughter. She's almost 14. She's highly competitive. Guy told me yesterday, she was training, playing one-on-one with this girl. One, trainer didn't like it. And I said, Charlotte, she goes, "Dad, I'm pissed, but I won't prove that trainer wrong." So I said, "Okay, but you know, there's two things. I'm going to say it. " I told you yesterday, one dude, you were there with the big boys now. I said, "I know I was a little boy. It's irritating me. " And I
Jaci Lund (29:52)
Took offense to that.
Rich Clark (29:53)
And another guy told me he's like, "You shouldn't go in this spot. You have no business opening a steakhouse. Let me Made me real angry. I'm going to print the text message out and I'm going to tape it on the back of the wall. Yeah. I am. And it's not cliche because that's just how I'm driven. It's in me. That's
Jaci Lund (30:10)
Why I think people that are creators, people that are builders, no matter what you're doing, that could break someone.
Rich Clark (30:18)
It's hard. If
Jaci Lund (30:18)
You're a creator and a builder in your soul that can only drive you forward.
Rich Clark (30:23)
It's hard.
Jaci Lund (30:23)
Yeah. And when it's eating at you, it's like it has to eat at me right now because it has to drive me
Rich Clark (30:28)
Forward. It's hard. And it's a good thing.
Jaci Lund (30:29)
It's not the easiest lifestyle.
Rich Clark (30:32)
But all of it is I enjoy it. There's certain things that I'm proud of. I have good partners. I have two partners that are supportive, but I run it. You know how I keep my sanity is just being mindful of things. I worked for La Berlin Den for Brass Re Lecos was his sister restaurant on La Bernardin and I worked with Maggie LaCoz and she's not an easy person to work for. But when Eric Rupair, he's a Buddhist and I know who he worked for. He worked for John Louis Paladin and I worked for a restaurant with John Louise and John Louise, God rest his soul, tough guy. And Eric's super laid back. So I'm like, man if this meditation thing worked for Eric and he's- Maybe
Jaci Lund (31:19)
He's onto
Rich Clark (31:19)
Something. Way more stressed than I am because he works with Madam Mozellacoes every day. Lord, help him. So I read a little bit on being mindful. I tried the meditation thing, but I just get angry when I meditate.
Jaci Lund (31:31)
Same. I can't do it.
Rich Clark (31:33)
Can't do it. Well, the main thing is I go in my closet and then I've got my wife and daughter yelling, "Let's get ready." And I'm like, "Eh." But what I do to- I could
Jaci Lund (31:42)
Stand. I'm like, "What am I supposed to not think while
Rich Clark (31:43)
I'm just
Jaci Lund (31:44)
Sitting here? I'm bored."
Rich Clark (31:45)
But it did make me mindful. Yeah. It made me mindful.
Jaci Lund (31:49)
All right. I have one more question for you. And then we'll wrap it up. So if you were going to give anyone advice, especially it relates to their brand, it doesn't necessarily have to be a new restaurant, it could be a new business, whatever, what advice would you give them?
Rich Clark (32:06)
Know who and what you are. Explain it to yourself, explain it to yourself, explain it to yourself, explain it to yourself. Not until you get it right, till you can't get it wrong. And once you figure that out, don't let anybody in your head, man. Pick it and go. Don't stop.
Jaci Lund (32:24)
Don't stop.
Rich Clark (32:25)
Don't stop. You're going to want to stop. People are going to get in your head. You're going to want to do this, figure out what you want. If you can't explain it to your mom or your dad or your significant other, you're not in a good space. But once you get it and you got it, you can't get it wrong. Don't change. Keep going. You won't fail.
Jaci Lund (32:45)
Thank you.
Rich Clark (32:45)
Thanks, Jason.
Jaci Lund (32:46)
It was awesome. This was so fun.
Rich Clark (32:47)
It was fun.
Announcer (32:48)
Thanks for listening to Beyond the Logo. If today's conversation sparked something, a question, an idea, or the realization that it's time to cultivate a brand that truly reflects who you are and connects with the audience you're meant to serve, we'd love to hear from you. Visit treebirdbranding.com to get in touch with JC and the team. Your brand deserves more than a template. Let's grow something that lasts.
